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A few moves I would like to see made


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#1 SportsGuy

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Posted 30 December 2011 - 11:42 AM

So, this is what I would be looking to do:

Trade 1:

Atlanta gets:

Adam Jones
Simon or BB

Detroit gets:
Jurrjens

Orioles get:

Prado
Minor
Castellanos
Smyly
Voss
http://web.minorleag... ... pid=592767
http://web.minorleag... ... pid=519391

Trade 2:

Orioles send Guthrie and Jim Johnson to the Angels for Bourjous and Morales

That has the team looking like this:

C- Wieters
1st- Davis/Morales
2nd- Prado
SS- Hardy
3rd- Reynolds
LF- Reimold
CF- Bourjous
RF- Nick
DH- Morales/Davis

Bench: Andino, Antonelli, TT, Chavez

Rotation: Minor, Britton, Arrieta, Matusz,Wada

Eveland also in the mix I guess.

BP:

Hunter- closer
Strop
Gregg
Patton
etc....

Now, the payroll isn't high here, so you have a lot of options that you can at least look into:

1) Do you go after Fielder? You could DH Morales and have Davis and Reynolds split time at third. You could also look to trade Reynolds and have Davis and Antonelli(and prado) at 3rd...with Castellanos coming quickly hopefully.

2) Do you go after Ryan Madson to be the closer? He is struggling to find a multi year deal.

3) Do you look to obtain an innings eater starter? I would think you would.

The payroll isn't that high(probably 70ish million..having worked out the numbers), so you still have moves you could make.

This team sets up better for 2012 IMO and with the addition of the young talent you get, it also sets you up better long term.

NOTE: This also assumes BRob is either not going to be there or starts the year on the DL.

#2 weams

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Posted 30 December 2011 - 06:13 PM

If you could make this occur, I would be all for it even if Morales never plays again.
A nervous breakdown divided into nine innings.

#3 Greg Pappas

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Posted 30 December 2011 - 08:48 PM

Rob, you and I see eye-to-eye more often than not, and you know I LOVE ME SOME TRADE DISCUSSION!... however I believe that Atlanta would not pull the trigger on that. I do believe that deal is not THAT far off from being realistic, despite the unlikelihood of a three-way trade. The reason I feel that the Braves would pull out, is that they wouldn't want to give up Minor after a solid debut season last year ON TOP OF dealing Jurrgens. They'd be losing 2/5th's of their starting staff. Dealing Jurrgens and a prospect like lefty Sean Gilmartin or righty Arodys Vizcaino (whom some feel is best suited as a reliever) might be more feasible. Again, solid effort -conceptually.

I'm confident that the Angels will not deal Bourjos, as he looks like he's going to be a star. Guthrie and Johnson will not get him... in my view at least. It's not necessarily that the trade value is that far off, but rather that it's not likely a match -from their end. I started a thread on Bourjos a coupe of months ago on the OH, and realized after I posted it, that the Angels were fairly intent on keeping him.

With all of this being said, I still love to conceptualize and read of others trade ideas... keep them coming.

#4 SportsGuy

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Posted 31 December 2011 - 12:30 PM

Rob, you and I see eye-to-eye more often than not, and you know I LOVE ME SOME TRADE DISCUSSION!... however I believe that Atlanta would not pull the trigger on that. I do believe that deal is not THAT far off from being realistic, despite the unlikelihood of a three-way trade. The reason I feel that the Braves would pull out, is that they wouldn't want to give up Minor after a solid debut season last year ON TOP OF dealing Jurrgens. They'd be losing 2/5th's of their starting staff. Dealing Jurrgens and a prospect like lefty Sean Gilmartin or righty Arodys Vizcaino (whom some feel is best suited as a reliever) might be more feasible. Again, solid effort -conceptually.

I'm confident that the Angels will not deal Bourjos, as he looks like he's going to be a star. Guthrie and Johnson will not get him... in my view at least. It's not necessarily that the trade value is that far off, but rather that it's not likely a match -from their end. I started a thread on Bourjos a coupe of months ago on the OH, and realized after I posted it, that the Angels were fairly intent on keeping him.

With all of this being said, I still love to conceptualize and read of others trade ideas... keep them coming.

I agree about Atlanta. I just look at Minor as the guy I would think they would deal first. He is good pitcher but isn't looked at as a guy that will likely be much more than a mid rotation guy and their other arms have more upside than he does.

As for Bourjos, i think people are really overrating the guy.

Don't get me wrong, he is a solid player and had a big WAR year last year. But he doesn't walk, doesn't have much power, steals bases at a poor rate and isn't a great average hitter. His defense is outstanding and he has good speed but he doesn't really do anything all that well.

As I pointed out on OH, he reminds me of Andres Torres. Torres had a WAR of almost 7 a few years ago but has been around a 2 WAR player in the years around that one. He is excellent defensively, has little power, also steals bases at a poor rate but he does walk at a very good rate. A few years ago, he looked like a stud. This offseason he was dealt for Angel Pagan.

I would want Bourjos to come in and give us some much needed team speed and his excellent defense but I don't look at his stats and see superstar or even all star. I see good role player that can help a team. Guthrie and Johnson give them a better chance to win IMO. That team, while they do have some long term pieces, is a team built to win right now. Pujols should have his best season next year. Hunter and Abreu are FAs. Kendrick is a FA soon. They will have some transition.

Guthrie solidifies the back of the rotation and Johnson gives them another top arm at the end of their pen and perhaps, in the closers role, which is a role they are looking to fill.

#5 Greg Pappas

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Posted 31 December 2011 - 05:50 PM

I agree about Atlanta. I just look at Minor as the guy I would think they would deal first. He is good pitcher but isn't looked at as a guy that will likely be much more than a mid rotation guy and their other arms have more upside than he does.

As for Bourjos, i think people are really overrating the guy.

Don't get me wrong, he is a solid player and had a big WAR year last year. But he doesn't walk, doesn't have much power, steals bases at a poor rate and isn't a great average hitter. His defense is outstanding and he has good speed but he doesn't really do anything all that well.

As I pointed out on OH, he reminds me of Andres Torres. Torres had a WAR of almost 7 a few years ago but has been around a 2 WAR player in the years around that one. He is excellent defensively, has little power, also steals bases at a poor rate but he does walk at a very good rate. A few years ago, he looked like a stud. This offseason he was dealt for Angel Pagan.

I would want Bourjos to come in and give us some much needed team speed and his excellent defense but I don't look at his stats and see superstar or even all star. I see good role player that can help a team. Guthrie and Johnson give them a better chance to win IMO. That team, while they do have some long term pieces, is a team built to win right now. Pujols should have his best season next year. Hunter and Abreu are FAs. Kendrick is a FA soon. They will have some transition.

Guthrie solidifies the back of the rotation and Johnson gives them another top arm at the end of their pen and perhaps, in the closers role, which is a role they are looking to fill.


Re: Bourjos. I agree that we see him differently, although from all indications the Angels seem to favor keeping him and his upside, as opposed to dealing him. Personaly I think adding Jones to the Guts and JJ trade idea would make more sense.

The Angels need someone batting fifth to protect Pujols, and Jones gives them that... plus he's a SoCal guy, and would love playing there. The more I think about adding Jones to the Guts/JJ package you devised, the more I see some real potential for a blockbuster deal.

Adam Jones, Jeremy Guthrie, and Jim Johnson for...

Peter Bourjos, CF

Kendry Morales, 1B

Garrett Richards, RHP, Grade B+: Borderline B. Hard to believe this guy couldn't get college hitters out, but he's come a long way in three years. I might be overrating him a tad with the B+, that grade is under review, but he looks like a strong mid-rotation starter to me and possibly more.

Kaleb Cowart, 3B, Grade B-: I want to see his bat outside the easy-offense Pioneer League, but a switch-hitting third baseman with power potential and a promising glove is intriguing. Needs to get the strike zone under control to thrive at higher levels.

John Hellweg, RHP, Grade B-: Weird season in the Cal League, was horrible in relief (7.71 ERA, 33/31 K/BB in 26 innings), but suddenly figured out how to pitch as a starter (2.12 ERA, 80/28 K/BB in 64 innings, 5.00 GO/AO). Upper-90s fastball, slider, changeup, 6-9 height. Is the breakthrough sustainable? If it is, will be at least a B+ a year from now.

http://www.minorleag...spects-for-2012

Hmmmm.... not far off in my view, although I imagine Angels fans would say they were giving up way too much.




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