813 replies to this topic

[BSLSteveBirrer]

Ricker I edited my original post just for you....lol.

[Mackus]

Ricker I edited my original post just for you....lol.

 

Since you think private companies insisting their employees be mandated to ensure the safety of their employees is ok, how is that any different than the government (local, state, or federal) making the same requirements of its employees?  

[Nigel Tufnel]

Is it really even a vaccine mandate?  Nobody's making him get vaccinated.  He's not going to get vaccinated.  He just isn't being allowed to coach the football team.

[BSLMikeLowe]

Is it really even a vaccine mandate?  Nobody's making him get vaccinated.  He's not going to get vaccinated.  He just isn't being allowed to coach the football team.

 

A big distinction there is the mandate means the university had to fire him for cause, and at least in theory owes him nothing for the remainder of his contract. If the school just said, "we'd rather you not be our football coach if you don't get vaccinated," they'd surely owe him either the remaining sum, or buyout amount, stated in his contract. And for a head coach of a P5 football program, that amounts to millions of dollars.

 

And while it might not be Rolovich himself as the Plaintiff, I think we can definitely expect court challenges. I think there was already one filed for the mandate in NY.

[BSLMikeLowe]

I mean the bolded part is complete conjecture and therefore irrelevant, unless you know some them personally or they've made public statements.

 

Don't really care if you change your opinion or not.  Just trying to do my own little part to dwindle the extreme viewpoints being lobbed by both sides.  But I'll reiterate that I think it would be far more selfish for an assistant to say "I demand that YOU get the vaccine so I can keep MY job."

 

 

 

 

selfish  adjective

self·​ish |  \ ˈsel-fish   \

Definition of selfish

 

1: concerned excessively or exclusively with oneself : seeking or concentrating on one's own advantage, pleasure, or well-being without regard for others

2: arising from concern with one's own welfare or advantage in disregard of othersa selfish act

 

 

I think Rolovich cleared the bar. As for his assistants, at least those who got vaccinated (4 did not and were also dismissed yesterday) then maybe it's selfish if they are only thinking of themselves. But they might also be thinking of their family who they will likely have to uproot and move as they go in search of new employment, I know that would be on my mind first and foremost. Simply because one man did not want to get the vaccine.

[Nigel Tufnel]

A big distinction there is the mandate means the university had to fire him for cause, and at least in theory owes him nothing for the remainder of his contract. If the school just said, "we'd rather you not be our football coach if you don't get vaccinated," they'd surely owe him either the remaining sum, or buyout amount, stated in his contract. And for a head coach of a P5 football program, that amounts to millions of dollars.

 

And while it might not be Rolovich himself as the Plaintiff, I think we can definitely expect court challenges. I think there was already one filed for the mandate in NY.

 

Yeah, no doubt that his decision has consequences.  I'm just saying that it's not really a mandate if you have the choice not to do it.  It's more like a condition of employment.

[Mike in STL]

Yeah, no doubt that his decision has consequences. I'm just saying that it's not really a mandate if you have the choice not to do it. It's more like a condition of employment.

Washington instituted a state mandate that all state employees had to be vaccinated by a certain date. I think I read that Rolovich, along with all the staff, are considered state employees, and this came as no surprise to the school who had been asking for a while, “hey, the deadline is coming, you doing this or not”.

[Nigel Tufnel]

Washington instituted a state mandate that all state employees had to be vaccinated by a certain date. I think I read that Rolovich, along with all the staff, are considered state employees, and this came as no surprise to the school who had been asking for a while, “hey, the deadline is coming, you doing this or not”.

 

Yeah, it was definitely a condition of employment.  I guess it's splitting hairs to some extent, but I'm just saying that it's not really a 'vaccine mandate' since he was free to choose not to get vaccinated.

[BSLSteveBirrer]

Since you think private companies insisting their employees be mandated to ensure the safety of their employees is ok, how is that any different than the government (local, state, or federal) making the same requirements of its employees?  

I wasn't going to respond but since you asked a reasonable question I guess I should give you my thoughts.

 

I don't like mandates like this for a couple of reasons.

 

1. I don't like after the fact changes to terms of employment. 

2. Just who makes a determination what is necessary for employees? Let me give you an example. The Department of Energy at Sandia Labs mandated senior management undergo "training" on their white privilege. That 'training'" stated that ""rugged individualism," "a can-do attitude," "hard work," and "striving towards success"—which sound good, but are in fact "devastating" to women and POCs."

3. Those entities making these "mandates" are inconsistent at best and totally disingenuous at worst. People are outraged when some fellow citizen for whatever reason chooses not to get the vaccine. Where is that same outrage for those allowing illegal immigrants to enter the country and then tax payer dollars are used to move them to all over the country. Not only are they not required to be vaccinated they don't even have to get tested for Covid. And the administration calling for the mandates in the first place gives the reason for this is that " “not intending to stay here for a lengthy period of time.” So tell me where is the science in that?

4. Do these same companies or government have a mandate for the flu vaccine? its contagious. It can be deadly. What's the difference????

 

Here's the bottom line. Based on the data I am comfortable with getting the vaccine and also comfortable being around others who may not. Others clearly don't feel that way. But be careful what you wish for. This is a very slippery slope.

[BSLMikeLowe]

I don't think Mike Gundy would have been a serious candidate for either LSU or USC, but smart preemptive move by OK St to renew his contract anyway.

 

https://www.espn.com...ntract-restored

[BSLMikeLowe]

My final words on the Rolovich/Wazzou situation:

 

As you would expect in a case like this with the present day national environment, there have been loud voices on both sides about who is right and who is wrong.

 

There were a number of Wazzou donors who threatened to withhold donations if he was fired.

 

There were also a number of donors who threatened to withhold donations if he wasn't.

 

Either way, the school did announce that this week alone it was able to raise the remaining $3.5 million it needed to fund a $30 million indoor practice facility (apparently to be used for all sports, not just football).

 

https://www.cougcent...ors-fundraising

[BSLMikeLowe]

Matt Wells out at Texas Tech. The Red Raiders are 5-3, so seems to me like an overreaction to Saturday when they blew a 14-point halftime lead to Kansas State.

[Mike in STL]

Matt Wells out at Texas Tech. The Red Raiders are 5-3, so seems to me like an overreaction to Saturday when they blew a 14-point halftime lead to Kansas State.

Not everyone sets the bar as low as Maryland.

Wells was 7-16 in conference play and only two wins against teams with a winning record.

[BSLMikeLowe]

Not everyone sets the bar as low as Maryland.

Wells was 7-16 in conference play and only two wins against teams with a winning record.

 

Fair point. Though Kliff Kingsbury had 2 winning seasons in 6 years at TT, three of those seasons with a future NFL MVP at QB....and he still got 6 years. Though he was an alum too, so that probably worked in his favor.

[BSLZackKiesel]

Matt Wells out at Texas Tech. The Red Raiders are 5-3, so seems to me like an overreaction to Saturday when they blew a 14-point halftime lead to Kansas State.

Quick! Fire him before he wins too many games!

[BSLZackKiesel]

Gary Patterson out at TCU after 21 years.

[BSLMikeLowe]

Gary Patterson out at TCU after 21 years.

He was the 2nd longest tenured head coach, after Kirk Ferentz. That title now goes to Kyle Wittingham at Utah.

[BSLMikeLowe]

Clay Helton. Finally.

 

 

Georgia Southern HC Chad Lunsford. The Eagles are 1-3.

 

While GAS is hardly noteworthy in the hierarchy of college football, I mention it because I can't help but wonder if his firing was more related to this incident Saturday than his record.

 

Clay Helton found his landing spot.

 

https://www.espn.com...ach-clay-helton

[Mackus]

My final words on the Rolovich/Wazzou situation:

 

As you would expect in a case like this with the present day national environment, there have been loud voices on both sides about who is right and who is wrong.

 

There were a number of Wazzou donors who threatened to withhold donations if he was fired.

 

There were also a number of donors who threatened to withhold donations if he wasn't.

 

Either way, the school did announce that this week alone it was able to raise the remaining $3.5 million it needed to fund a $30 million indoor practice facility (apparently to be used for all sports, not just football).

 

https://www.cougcent...ors-fundraising

 

This story has gotten a little more interesting, I think.  Originally it was reported that he had applied for a religious exemption and it was denied.  The original story included that WSU was using a double blind method for religious exemption applications (which is a very good thing).  The staffers who decide if an religious exemption request was "sincerely held" or whatever terminology they use to say if it was a real reason or a made-up-reason-because-I-don't-want-the-vaccine, do not know the names or jobs of the people applying for the exemption.  This allows them to decide on the merits.  The original story reported the ratio of exemptions that were approved of the ones applied for, it was over half but not close to all.  So it sounded like they were actually considering and deciding on all these applications.  And Rolovich's was denied.  So that seemed like a thorough and honest way to have judged his request, and then they could fire him for not getting vaccinated and not having an exemption.

 

But Rolovich's appeal against WSU says that his request for religious exemption was in fact approved by the impartial, blind review board.  But afterwards the AD Chun superceded and denied the request after-the-fact, because he said that Rolovich had been telling him all along he wasn't going to get the vaccine, which to him meant that his religious exemption request wasn't sincere. 

 

That, to me, seems like BS.  You can't have an independent review board that determines the sincerity of someone's religious beliefs, and then have someone high up reverse those decisions (in either direction).

 

I think they have to pay this guy to go away.  They can't fire him for cause if his request for religious exemption was approved.  Unless he outright refuses to abide by the accommodations they would have to set in place to allow an unvaccinated employee be around other employees and students.  But he must have been meeting those accommodations all along, right?  Masks and stuff when coaching, remote meetings, etc etc. 

[BSLMikeLowe]

It will be an interesting case, and I'm curious to see if it hits on the Constitutional legality of vaccine mandates, or ends up being more narrow in scope.

 

WSU's reasoning for denying the exemption, as I understand it, is that despite the approval of the blind review board the university believed that Rolovich could not adequately perform the duties of his position due to his unvaccinated status, and that the state mandate did allow them to overrule and dismiss him. What their specific argument is as far as him being unable to do his job, I have not heard. I do know he was prevented from certain in-person settings and had to do some of his job duties virtually. Maybe the school felt that would put them at a huge recruiting disadvantage.

 

I would bet on a financial settlement being the final resolution here.